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Not-So-Speedy Dressage

From Endurance to Dressage

Saddle Fitter

7/3/2014

 
The saddle fitter was out this past weekend. Good thing she’s really nice as I peppered her with questions the entire time she worked. She’s adjusted my saddle’s flocking for the past three years, and I always have new questions for her.

I popped over to my trainer’s barn on Friday just to watch some lessons. Even though I don’t jump, I enjoy watching the other gals go, and they are always quite tolerant of my questions (I ask EVERYONE questions). I just learned what chipping means (adding a stride). After everyone was done riding, we had a discussion about saddle fitting. No one at JL’s barn ever has their saddles adjusted, and when I asked why not, no one seemed to know why it was necessary.

So when Tina Hoover, my saddle fitter, showed up, that was my first question: why don’t the H/Js get their saddles adjusted? The simple answer was that many jumping saddles have foam inside and not flocking. Hmm … didn’t know that. The more complicated answer had a lot do with how little contact with the horse’s back that H/Js have. Dressage riders have far more contact with their horses’ backs and are far more likely to feel when the saddle isn’t sitting quite right.

And that was exactly why I felt my saddle needed some work. For the past little while, I have felt that I was tilting to the right. My saddle wasn’t slipping, but I just felt … crooked. I always assume that any glitch in my riding experience has to do with my ineptness. If my saddle feels crooked, it’s probably me, but since she was scheduled to be in my area, I figured having her professional eye was a good call.
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Tina Hoover - Saddle Fitter, Eventer, and More!
Surprisingly, the crookedness wasn’t completely my fault. The flocking under my left thigh had been compacted and was in need of re-fluffing/re-stuffing. In addition, the pommel of my saddle had also dropped; it’s hard to sit back when your saddle is pitching you forward!

Tina had me hop up on Speedy G, saddled without a pad, so that she could see how her adjustments worked in real life. Right away I felt that I was sitting more deeply into the saddle and it was a whole lot easier to sit up and back. Tina called it giving me a different place to sit. Definitely.
Picture
Tina's checking the fit on Sydney.
Then we put the saddle on Sydney. It was better than it had been, but right away I could feel that my pelvis was tipped forward, and I didn’t have that same feeling of sitting on my seat bones. Tina snapped this quick photo, which proved that what I was feeling was correct. Believe it or not, Speedy is actually wider than Sydney. So on him, the pommel sits up higher, which allows me to sit in the deepest part of my saddle’s seat. Since Sydney is a bit narrower, the saddle’s pommel drops down slightly over his withers. There’s still plenty of clearance, but I am pitched forward a little bit.
Picture
The orange line shows how un-level I am right now.
This was very interesting because when Tina was out last year, the saddle sat pretty evenly on both horses while the year before, it fit like it did this weekend. Tina had a very interesting explanation for the change. She said that one possibility is that as a horse works in a more uphill frame, the muscling around the withers gets narrower. There’s a lengthy explanation as to why, and I am not sure that I understand it well enough to explain it, but it did seem to fit with the work that Sydney has been doing this past year.

Fortunately, the fix is pretty easy. Since the saddle fit Speedy so well, it seemed easier to just go back to the riser pad that I had been using on Sydney last year. It raises the front of the saddle by about an inch, which is hopefully all he needs. 

Since I started riding in a dressage saddle, I’ve had my saddle’s flocking adjusted once a year. We don’t have any local saddle fitters, but if we did, I think I would have my saddle looked at every six months. That leads me to ask: if you’re a H/J, is your saddled filled with foam or flocking? If it’s flocked, do you get it adjusted? For the dressage crowd, how often do you have your saddled adjusted? 

I told you I ask a lot of questions.
Austen link
7/2/2014 11:30:29 pm

I always assumed the withers got wider with more muscling ... but then I guess Guinness' have gotten both wider and narrower depending on our training and the time of year. Research time!! :)

My jumping saddle is foam flocked. In my experience a lot of newer saddles are going to foam, but the really expensive ones are still wool. The lack of a deep seat in most jumping disciplines does make it easier to get away with a marginal fit.

Send your saddle fitter my way! We have almost zero access to an independent fitter, and she sounds amazing. ;)

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:16:09 am

Tina already comes from near San Diego which is several hours south of here. We're not blessed with saddle fitters either!

Tina tried to explain the narrowing of the withers like this: as the top line develops, the withers are lifted with the long tendon and other musculature. As they rise up, they get narrower.

Or, at least that was my understanding. :0)

We also discussed the differences between flocked and foam saddles. She has a flocked saddle herself (she's a Rep for County saddles) so that she can adjust it as needed.

Katharine Marie link
7/2/2014 11:34:46 pm

Interesting questions! And questions are good... ;)

I actually bought my first English saddle this year, always ridden Western before that. And this saddle is a Wintec... synthetic... and is not flocked, but has air panels. So, that is my situation. :)

Karen
7/3/2014 01:39:53 am

Have you had any issues with the CAIR system? My horse absolutely hated the dressage saddle with the CAIR system that I tried on him (Isabelle). I really think he could feel the edges of the plastic squares they use as flocking in those saddles. I've read that other riders have had the same issue.

What has your experience been?

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:19:21 am

I actually liked the Isabel saddle and I didn't have any problems with the CAIR system. Now that I have my Custom Saddlery dressage saddle, I wouldn't like the Isabel, but back then, it was a good fit.

Karen
7/3/2014 01:40:00 am

Have you had any issues with the CAIR system? My horse absolutely hated the dressage saddle with the CAIR system that I tried on him (Isabelle). I really think he could feel the edges of the plastic squares they use as flocking in those saddles. I've read that other riders have had the same issue.

What has your experience been?

Karen
7/3/2014 01:40:06 am

Have you had any issues with the CAIR system? My horse absolutely hated the dressage saddle with the CAIR system that I tried on him (Isabelle). I really think he could feel the edges of the plastic squares they use as flocking in those saddles. I've read that other riders have had the same issue.

What has your experience been?

Sarah link
7/3/2014 02:03:02 am

I ride in the Bases Isabelle with CAIR. Haven't had any issues, though I've needed to change the gullet out to change fit (fyi, "easy change" gullet system is just a marketing ploy. took me several days and lots of swear words to change it).

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:17:53 am

My first English saddle was a brand new flocked Wintec Dressage. I had it for about a year before I bought a used, Wintec Isabel Dressage with the CAIR panels, so I totally get that those aren't really "adjustable." :0)

Karen
7/3/2014 01:37:47 am

After two years of searching, I have my saddle. It fits us both and Ashke is not back sore at the end of a ten mile ride. It is flocked, because I did not want to run into issues if we changed our style of riding and the shape of his back changed. (again.) Since we are doing dressage, working equitation and trail riding, with the hopes of doing our first 25 LD in August, I needed something that could be changed and adapted to his back as our work changed.

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:20:59 am

I was really surprised at how much adjusting my fitter has done each time she's come out. Fortunately both my boys have similarly shaped backs so I can use the same saddle, but I am glad that it has proven to be so adjustable.

Lauren link
7/3/2014 01:43:05 am

My saddle is foam flocked, which has its issues for sure. You know, maybe you should try a jumping lesson sometime. You may love it! :)

Sarah link
7/3/2014 02:03:52 am

I agree with Lauren! Next time you're in town you can take Hemie over some jumps =)

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:26:34 am

see below :0) I'm game if Hemie is.

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:25:35 am

My endurance saddles weren't adjustable, of course, but I managed to get through multiple 1-day 100 mile rides and multiple days rides (200 miles over 4 days for example), so a good pad can do a lot for a saddle.

Even though our endurance horses' back changed over time, I never had saddle fit issues. I did make changes to my pads though. In your experience, is a pad change enough to accommodate most decent saddles?

And believe it or not, I've been totally eyeballing some of the cross rails in the arena. :0)

Sarah - I'll be there a week from Friday for the El Sueno show, and I would TOTALLY take you up on a chance to hop over something small with Hemie!!!!!!

Tracy link
7/3/2014 02:28:53 am

I use a saddle fitter [and I ride/show hunters]! And purposefully bought a wool-flocked saddle so that I could have it adjusted :)

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:27:34 am

The saddle fitter did the same thing - bought a wool flocked saddle.

Amanda link
7/3/2014 02:42:39 am

I've always owned wool-flocked saddles, save for a brief flirtation with a CAIR system Wintec that I loved but Tristan loooooooathed.

It is possible to get the foam removed and have the saddle reflocked with wool. It's costly, but if you have a nice saddle that you love and adjusting it would help it fit the horse better, it's worth it. Plus, you get a more adjustable saddle going forward.

I have my saddles adjusted when needed. Both of Tristan's were done earlier this spring. I'll do the jump saddle again in the fall but hold off on the dressage saddle until next spring again. It's amazing how much their backs change!

(for the record - primarily an eventer/dressage rider though my jump saddle came to me from a H/J rider)

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 03:29:11 am

Very interesting. It sounds like some people like the ease of foam while others prefer the adjustability of wool flocking.

bonita link
7/3/2014 01:26:38 pm

I probably can't weigh in that much, I've never had a flocked or foam saddle. We've always had CAIR panels in our Wintecs. So far, all our horses have seemed to like them - not sure if that's just because we haven't tried anything else?

Copper has a really sensitive back though, and seems to be ok with CAIR system. That's the problem with Australia; it's really hard to buy second hand saddles or try out different kinds. None of our saddle fitters have any saddles floating around that you can just try. You have to guess what'll work and just buy it! Expensive to try and test new saddles out.

bonita of <a href="http://www.aridinghabit.blogspot.com.au/">A Riding Habit</a>

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 10:32:45 pm

Finding a good, well-ftting saddle is hard enough when you have choices. It must be really tough when you can't try anything out. I am surprised your distributors don't have demo models; that's quite a popular option here.

I had two Wintec saddles when I first started riding dressage, one with the CAIR panels. It worked for me. :0)

Libby Henderson
7/3/2014 03:41:40 pm

I can go down the road of "way more than you ever wanted to know" on this issue, as my first event horse had 19 saddles in a nine year career. Yes, that's correct. *19*

I am totally and completely a wool flocked saddle person, but this article talks about the differences and comes out on the other side. http://www.iselltack.com/blogs/news/14749697-inside-the-saddle-team-wool-vs-team-foam

Libby Henderson
7/3/2014 03:45:32 pm

One of the reasons you see both that article being in favor of foam, is that she sells mainly French saddles and they are almost exclusively foam flocked. That is also what is most popular in the h/j world and now is steadily making inroads in the eventing world. Many of the French makers have a big prescience at events and their saddles feel and look beautiful. I just don't think they work well for every horse. But, there are many opinions to the contrary. :)

Bakersfield Dressage link
7/3/2014 10:46:15 pm

Very interesting article, Libby, thanks for sharing. And what a timely coincidence!

Your point is almost exactly what my saddle fitter shared: french saddle makers have really put their products out there in a big way: endorsements, product placement, etc. My saddle fitter explained that many riders (like me!) go with what we see heavily marketed and endorsed. And once a brand becomes fashionable, it becomes "good." Not saying they aren't good saddles, but like you said, not every saddle works for every horse.

Stealing from the ballet example: I used a lot of different endurance pads over the years. Talk about needing a good pad - if you're going to ride 100 miles in one day, you better have good, quality stuff. I ultimately ended up choosing Equipedic pads that have memory foam. I loved the pads, and they worked for several of my endurance horses. When I started riding Speedy in the Equipedic pads, his back got sore. Guess what I switched to. Yep, a Toklat WOOL pad. Thank goodness we have choices! :0)


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    About the Writer and Rider

    ​I am a lifelong rider. 
    I began endurance riding in 1996 where I ultimately completed five, one-day 100 mile races, the 200-mile Death Valley Encounter, and numerous other 50, 65, and 75 mile races. I began showing dressage in 2010.
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